Typical Sunday-Protagonist Rhetoric and Attitude
From BibleStudyForum.com
Find the initial statement by ‘John’, in
full after comments.
GE:
John, had you not written,
“Below is some information that I
hope will increase your understanding of the Sabbath rest”,
but would have written, ‘of the Christian’s rest’, I would scarcely have found
reason to protest. For example, what could be truer than that “Jesus Christ came to complete a redemptive work (Jn.
4:34; 5:36) by restoring the rest that was forfeited in the Garden. In
following the same pattern for the first creation, Jesus Christ began the work
spoken of in Genesis 3:15 (c.f. Gen. 1:3). He completed the work on the cross
(Jn. 17:4; 19:30; c.f. Gen. 1:5). The work was met with God’s satisfaction by
the resurrection and ascension of Christ (
Please do not think that I
would ever deny it. I will not, I pray
God, not ever.
But, .... the Scriptural references and your associations
between them,
“Genesis 3:15” – “I shall
put enmity .... thou shalt bruise his heel” – “c.f. Gen. 1:3”, “And God
said, Let there be light, and there was light” .... relevance? “Jesus Christ began the work spoken of in Genesis 3:15”? Is that it?
“Jn. 17:4; 19:30”, “I have glorified Thee on the earth: I have finished
the work which Thou gavest Me to do .... He said, It is finished” – “c.f. Gen. 1:5”, “God
called the light, day, and the darkness He called night; and the evening and
the morning were the First Day” .... relevance? .... correlation? “He completed the work on the cross”? .... in “Gen. 1:5” ....?!
“The work”, “Gen. 1:4”, “And God
saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness”—
“was met with God’s
satisfaction by the resurrection and ascension of Christ ....
Do you worship
light? do you worship the Sun? Sunday? Do you worship the created for the
Creator?
“Heb. 10:11-12”, “Every
priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices
which can never take away sins: But this Man after He had offered one sacrifice
for sins for ever , sat down at the right hand of God”, “c.f. Gen. 2:1-3)”, “In the
beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form,
and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God
moved upon the face of the waters. And God said, let there be light: and there
was light.” Relevance?
Correlation? ..... “.... leading again to divine rest”?
“The priest and the prophet have erred
through strong drink; they are swallowed up of wine; they are out of the way
through strong drink; they err in vision; they stumble in judgment.
(Conference) tables are full of vomit; (judgment halls) of filthiness; there is
no spot, clean. Whom shall he teach knowledge? whom shall he make understand
doctrine? Todlers weaned from the milk?
babies, drawn from the breasts? For he
argues precept upon precept; line upon line; line upon line; here a little
(from the Scriptures), there a little (from the Scriptures): for with
stammering lips (of the drunkard) and another tongue (of him sober) will he
speak to this people.” Isaiah 28:7 “Thou art confident that thou thyself art a
guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, an instructor of the
foolish, a teacher of babes .... Thou therefore which teachest another,
teachest thou not thyself?” Ro2:20-21.
You
cannot prevent truth... you can only for fear of it, try run away from it.
Observer:
“You cannot prevent truth... you can only get fixated on
externals in order to avoid the internals. This is what we call legalism.
Thank you, son, for your time.”
GE:
That was your definition of what you, “call legalism”. If I may
have a turn to define ‘legalism’ I’ll use Jesus’ argument, that legalism is to
throw God’s ‘externals’ – the commandments of God
– overboard and replace them with one’s own ‘internals’, one’s own laws and works
and own justification and righteousness – in other words, “legalism” is defined: hypocricy!
It’s better to ‘get fixated on externals’ that at least are relevant, cohesive, and correct, than to ‘get fixated’ on ‘internals’ that are as wayward as one’s ‘externals’.
Observer:
I
point out your fixation, and you intensive that fixation.
Young
man, I am a Jewish convert to Christianity. If I thought that there was any way
to obtain salvific merit through the Law, don't you think I'd be the first to
be jumping on the legalism bandwagon?
GE:
No; take care lest you fall
off it.
John:
“The Sabbath was a command given specifically to
GE:
You are absolutely right!
Specifically to the People
of God; not to any unbelievers or the Godless. Not that God gave the Sabbath
command to
It is exactly the same
scenario in both the Old and the New Testaments. Even so the Gospel is called “the
EVERLASTING Gospel” in Revelation 14:6, because it had begun since the
creation of God. Yea, Christ is called that Everlasting Gospel in Revelation,
where He is said to be “The BEGINNING of the creation of God”, 3:14. Said you yourself, “In following the same pattern for the first creation,
Jesus Christ began the work spoken of in Genesis ....”.
Who overturned the apple
cart?
John:
“There is no biblical record whatsoever of anybody
keeping the Sabbath prior to Exodus 16 (Neh. 9:13-14).”
Once again you are
absolutely right, and I want to stress how strongly I endorse what you are
saying here. What really happened where you have said, “In following the same pattern for the first creation,
Jesus Christ began the work spoken of in Genesis 3....”,
was that Jesus Christ began the work of redemption ON THE SABBATH DAY, the
Seventh Day. Genesis 3 is a continuation of the history of the fall on the
Sixth Day that Adam and Eve were created and no sooner than they were tempted,
sinned, and never for one day had entered into the rest or the day that God had
prepared for them. God visited them in the twilight of the Sabbath’s evening
after sunset “in the cool of day” after the Sixth Day Gn3:8, and found them
hiding from his Holy Presence because they knew they sinned. After that God had
clad them in skins of their sin-offering which He had made FOR them, God sent
them out of the
So, “There is no biblical record whatsoever of anybody
keeping the Sabbath prior to Exodus 16 (Neh. 9:13-14)....”
prior to ELECTION AND SALVATION!
John:
“Even after they received the full-blown Sabbath command
(Ex. 20:8-11),
GE:
Yes. Again, yes! So sinful were they, they scarcely noticed
and never criticized their OWN violation of the Sabbath. But it did not go
unnoticed by God who most often and most specifically, punished his people for
breaking not THEIR, but “MY” – God’s – “Sabbaths”. God took very personally, the transgression
of his Sabbaths.
You may think what you like
about the Sabbath, but if you are a Christian, this is the SAME, GOD, who still
is your Sovereign. I wonder what would
make Him change his mind about “My Sabbaths” if it was “Jesus Christ” who “In following the same pattern for the first creation,
began the work spoken of in Genesis 3....” to only in the New
Testament, have “FINISHED” it— to only “on the Seventh Day” have
finished it, to only when “THROUGH THE SON” and “God from all his
works, RESTED” have finished it? Hb1:2, 4:4. Was it much ado about nothing that “God
thus concerning the Seventh Day spake”? Hb4:4. I do not think so.
I wonder what would make God
change his mind about “My Sabbaths”? What will be next? That he may
change his mind about his elect .... about me ....? God forbid!
Yes, God never made great
fuss about
John:
“The Sabbath was part of God’s ceremonial law and not
grounded in His unchanging character.”
GE:
After what we have spoken
above, will you still say this? Have you
not seen how the Sabbath was grounded – yea, originated from – God’s Works
through Jesus Christ towards the salvation of his Elect? And does not Christ Himself confirm it when
He says that “the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath”? God of course in his Omnipotence and
Omniscience KNEW BEFORE that man was going to fall away from Grace, and
therefore PREPARED for it, and therefore created, “MADE”, the Sabbath
Day FOR “his rest from his own works as God” Hb4:10. IN Christ Jesus and THROUGH Christ Jesus— “In following the same pattern for the first creation”.
“The Sabbath was .... not grounded
in His unchanging character”, you say. The Sabbath was not made “for” man’s
works or merit, but for God in his gracious condescending “to us-ward”— “was
made”, for God where He works “for man” — for God where He is “for
man” in his NEED of God.
What is the ‘character’ of the Sabbath then? The Sabbath is not one’s rest from sin; our
rest from sin is Christ. The Sabbath is not
the forgiveness of our sins; the
sacrifice Of Christ was the forgiveness of all sins. The Sabbath is not our victory over sin; the
resurrection of Christ is God’s – not our – victory over sin and death. The Sabbath is not the Rest of God; the Rest
of God, is ‘Christ for us’! I do not say the Sabbath gives that rest of God’s
Promises; or that it is, that rest; no, I say – I ask – is the Sabbath not “grounded in” GOD’S, UTMOST WORKS of
redemption and salvation? Would you say
no? that it is not? Would you? Then how
could you say the Sabbath was not grounded in God’s
unchanging character? Does God have
a changing side to his character in which the Sabbath “was grounded”?
What you ARE saying – what
you DID say – is, that “The
Sabbath was part of God’s ceremonial law”. Now even with that, I can and do, fully
agree. The Sabbath is a day, a doing, of both man and God, or it is senseless
to both man and God. The Sabbath is, truly, “ceremonial law”, or God never could have commanded
You see, dear John, exactly
this was what “the principalities and powers” of the world just couldn’t
stomach, to see “the Body of Christ’s Own”, “feast Sabbaths’ Feast”
of Christ, and wanted to spoil both The Body and its Sabbaths’ Feasting “through
philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of
the world, and not after Christ.”
The authorities and dominion even went so far as to “Issue indictment
against us / subpoena us, write laws adverse to us”, but Christ “took it
out of the way, he nailed it to the cross (so to speak). Having spoiled
them, He made a spectacle of them – openly the laughingstock – having TRIUMPHED
OVER THEM IN IT” – “IN IT”, in / by his resurrection from the dead
Col2:12,13— “SABBATH’S” (as stated in Mt28:1).
God originally “made the
Sabbath” to the service of the Promised Redeemer and to the very end stuck
to his Eternal Purpose with both. “Let
no man beguile you of your reward— by no man who in arbitrary humility worships
(evil) messengers (believes strange doctrines), who intrudes into things
he does not discern or understand himself, things which nevertheless by his
fleshly-mindedness he is vainly puffed up about.” Col2:18. Verse 18 is
given as an encouraging and “comforting” 2:2 admonition to “The Body
of Christ’s Own” 2:17b over their “Feasting of Sabbaths’ Feast” 16b,
and is an emphatic repetition virtually, of verse 16a, “Let no one (of the
world) therefore judge or condemn you over your eating or drinking, or over
your eating and drinking of (any) Feast either of month’s or of Sabbaths’
(recurrence)”.
Therefore sure, “The Sabbath was part of God’s ceremonial law”,
but as certainly was ‘grounded in
His unchanging character.”
John:
“The Sabbath ....
Similar to the entire old covenant, it has been fulfilled and brought to
completion in Christ (Mt. 5:17).”
GE:
Amen! “....fulfilled and brought to completion in Christ”,
true and similar to the New Covenant indeed ... indeed in Genesis 3 already “in Christ”.
John:
“If David had a right to make an exception in the
ceremonial law, Jesus had more (Mt. 12:1-8; c.f 5:21-48).”
GE:
I cannot see what “exception in the ceremonial law”
you are referring to. If one read the story in the OT one would see how David
acted as type of Christ who to the last letter fulfilled the typology of “the ceremonial law”. That is what people cannot discern: that “the
Sabbath was made FOR” .... which means was created and reserved / “sanctified”
and preserved / “blessed” Gn2:3, for the WORKS of God in the COMPLETION
of ALL his works IN CHRIST and THROUGH CHRIST. Only then and only AFTER so “fulfilled and brought to completion in Christ”,
could the Sabbath be of any service or worth “for man” or “for the
People of God”— Hb4:8-10. NOT and NEVER BEFORE! First for the Last Adam
BEFORE “for man”, “the first Adam”.
You said, dear John, “There is no biblical record whatsoever of anybody
keeping the Sabbath prior to Exodus 16 (Neh. 9:13-14).”
Allow me to add, There is no biblical record whatsoever of anybody keeping the
Sabbath truly, prior to the Coming of the Son of Man; truly, prior to the
Coming of the Son of Man FROM THE DEAD!
The only thing in the last analysis that gives Christian meaning to
God’s Sabbath Day is the fact Jesus rose upon it, “in the mid-afternoon of
the Sabbath’s fullness as it began to dawn towards the First Day of the week”.
That was the Sabbath’s ONLY perfect fulfilment EVER. Not once before; not once
ever after! And therefore – in the very
last analysis – there shall be nobody whosoever who shall have kept the Sabbath
truly, prior to the Coming of the Son of Man on the clouds of heaven; prior to
the resurrection FROM THE DEAD and the new earth inhabited by incorruptible
redeemed who shall truly keep the Sabbath of the LORD their God, Jesus Christ,
Lord of the Sabbath Day.
Now imagine the First Day
of the week thus on the New Earth observed and celebrated instead? Where will the “biblical record” of such a ‘ceremony’ or economy come from?
John:
“Even Jesus said," The Sabbath was made for man,
and not man for the Sabbath" (Mk. 2:27). Moreover, He called Himself the
"Lord of the Sabbath" (Lk. 6:5).”
GE:
May I regard this as an
acknowledgement of the truth I have told you so far? What better, what greater, what nobler
declaration and proclamation could you desire or require for the lordly and
CHRISTIAN status of “The Lord’s Day” “the Seventh Day Sabbath of the
LORD your God” than what you have given here, yourself? IS NOT CHRIST HIMSELF THAT LORD? AND IS HE NOT THAT LORD BY TRIUMPH OF HIS
RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD? Which other
day then could receive the indebtedness to Christ’s Lordship than the Sabbath
He is Lord of and Lord over? Which other
day is so “grounded in the charater of God”? The First Day of the week? Since when? Since
where? Since WHAT? “HERETOFORE My
Father WORK and I, WORK!” “Heretofore”
was it, that God in Christ worked: ON THE SABBATH. But because you separate
God’s Works (‘externals’) from God’s
‘character’
(‘internals’),
the Sunday should get the honour and receive the dignity for God’s works’
sake? By what rule? by what law? by what
kind of right or righteousness or justice or justification? How was Sunday ever “grounded in the charater of God”?
To be “grounded in the charater of God”
it should be “grounded”
in the WORKS of God— which WORKS of God clearly, should be that of the Sabbath
Day of his REST, AFTER the ‘externals’
of the creation.
John:
“The Sabbath was the sign of the Old Covenant (Ex.
31:16-17; Neh. 9:14; Eze. 20:12).”
GE:
No fine; what was the
Sunday ever a sign of?
What do you mean with ‘sign’? Something like the Church says baptism is a
sign? My catechism taught me the sign of
baptism is a seal to Covenant relationship. So do you mean ‘sign’ as a seal to
or in Covenant relationship? Covenant
relationship to what or whom? Covenant
relationship to God and to God in Christ?
Was the Sabbath such a sign? Then
what do you have for the Sunday like it?
Nothing? But still Sunday should
be that ‘sign’ under the New Covenant?
I do not accept!
O, but it was the ‘Old’
Covenant, you say. Alright, “The Sabbath was the sign of the Old Covenant”
then. ‘Covenant’ between whom? Between God and
Therefore, What WAS ‘wrong’
with God’s ‘Old Covenant’? Only that it was not FULFILLED YET! So that the New Covenant, is the Old Covenant
of God but ratified in Jesus Christ, that’s all! “God’s Eternal Purpose”; God’s “Everlasting
Covenant”; “The Mystery which hath been HID from ages and generations,
but NOW is made MANIFEST to his saints.” Col1:26.
Or do you define ‘Old
Covenant’ that it is “ceremonial”?
Then you should define New Covenant that it is without ceremony or ceremonies.
Then what is keeping Sunday but keeping a ceremony; or water-baptism; or the
Lord’s Supper; or confirmation; or Congregation for that matter; or prayer, or
praise? Ceremony, ceremony! And rightfully so! Dead right for you if it is Sunday so kept; ‘externals’, ‘legalism’ if the Bible-Sabbath is so kept. While the heart of the matter is not man’s
works of the Sabbath, but God’s WORKS of the Sabbath for man’s benefit through
the Son of Man! Mk2:27-28.
Or do you define ‘Old
Covenant’ that it is bloody? Is the
Sabbath or the Seventh Day bloody? I don’t know you, but I say yes, bloodiest
of all days: “For the LIFE is in the blood” of Jesus Christ, who offered
Himself not only the Sacrifice for sin, but in the last instance for the
Oblation of sins have offered and proffered Himself an Odour of LIFE and First
Sheaf Waved Before the LORD, an Offering, once for all in having taken up his
LIFE again. (Hb13:20) “I saw a Lamb stood (just) as it had been slain”
Rv5:6 – Christ in his resurrection and NEW Covenant relationship with God’s
People, the Resurrected Crucified; the Risen Sacrificed.
Therefore by all means, “The Sabbath was the sign of the Old Covenant (Ex.
31:16-17; Neh. 9:14; Eze. 20:12).”
And in the same manner, is it sign of the New Covenant and New-Covenant
relationship. “Therefore remains a keeping of the Sabbath Day for the People
of God for He that is entered into his rest, He also hath ceased from his own
works as God from his.” Where or how will you find a clearer or more Covenant
connection than this between the Sabbath and its keeping by the People of God
and the resurrection of Christ from the dead WHEREBY AND WHEREIN “He that is
entered into His rest, also hath ceased from His own works as God from His”?
God NEVER otherwise than
this, “rested the Seventh Day” Hb4:4; because God never otherwise than
through Jesus Christ, “rested the Seventh Day”; because God never than
through Jesus Christ but by “the Power of His Resurrection”, “rested
the Seventh Day”.
The three main ingredients
so to speak of Covenant Relationship, The Covenanter, the covenanted, and the
sign of covenant-relationship: God in Christ through Resurrection from the
dead, the People of God, and the Sabbath Day’s “reinstated validity”
(‘apoleipetai sabbatismos’), “grounded
in His unchanging character”,
“grounded”
in the Everlasting Covenant of Grace.
John:
“Because we are now under the New Covenant we are no
longer under obligation to keep the Old Covenant, particularly the sign of the
Old Covenant. The writer to the Hebrews remarked, "When He said, ‘A new
covenant,’ He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete
and growing old is ready to disappear" (Heb. 8:13).”
GE:
“In saying (I
will make 8:10) a New Testament,
God has made the first
(covenant) old;
and that which is made old
and grows in age, is near vanishing.”
“The first covenant” 9:1 (described at length in some detail
in chapters 7 and 9),
A) “had a worldly / earthly sanctuary”
which “was made with hands” 9:24; and which “decayed and waxed old
and was near vanishing” 8:13b, and
B) “a priesthood .... after the law of a
carnal commandment” 7:16.
But “Christ
was Most Perfect Tabernacle, the true” 9:11a
A) “which the Lord pitched, and not man”
8:2;
“not made with hands”,
“not of this building / creation” ‘heh ktisis’ 9:11c.
B) “another Priest after the law of the power
of an endless Life” 7:16; “Priest of the Most High God” 7:1.
The “tabernacle” or
“building”, changed “of necessity / naturally” because the first
“grew old”.
“The priesthood being
changed there is made of necessity a change also of the law” 7:12 concerning
the “priesthood”.
The “laws” of ‘externals’ of “inevitability / neccesity”,
‘changed’— from the transitory to the Eternal; from the “carnal” to the
Divine— Christ.
No “laws” of ‘internals’ or essentials or “first
principles”, ‘changed’. “Saith the LORD; I will put MY Laws (which
together in Christ IS Christ and in the OT together, WERE the Covenant) in
their minds, and will write them (God’s Laws Christ our Law; in the OT: “My
Covenant” 8:9c) in their hearts: And I (Yahweh, Jesus Christ) will
be to them GOD; and THEY, to Me, shall be, ‘My People’!” 8:10.
It says NOTHING of any “particularly sign of the Old Covenant”.
The ‘sign’ (‘sehmeion’ Ez20:12) you are insinuating, was that “particular sign of the” Ownership of God and
belonging of
The Sabbath NEVER was a
‘sign’ of the “obsolete”
and “disappeared”,
“first tabernacle (or its) building” or its “dispensations”
or its “ministrations”— NEVER! So
far as ‘covenant’ can be defined ‘relationship’, so far can it be said is the
Sabbath a sign of the covenant – the everlastingly New, Covenant of Grace. But
of that ‘tabernacle’ or ‘building’ or ‘creation’ that by
now had “vanished” altogether, the Sabbath never has been the ‘sign’
of.
That is how God made “obsolete” and let “disappear” “the first (Covenant) .... particularly .... the Old Covenant”,
“BECAUSE THEY, continued not in My Covenant” 8:9. “He finds fault
with THEM!” Hb8:8. Everything else
of God’s Covenant, “continued” JUST THE SAME, faultless. That’s why
God’s New Covenant is simply God putting his Covenant and Covenant Laws (the
same thing) in the hearts and minds of his Covenanted People – Spiritual Israel
– and not merely engraves his Covenant or Law in tables of stone all over
again. And that is why there is not the
SLIGHTEST difference between the New Covenant in or under the New Testament and
that very same New Covenant covenanted or closed or made by God in or under the
Old Testament or Old Testament dispensation— NOT THE SLIGHTEST!
The fact the Ten Commandments
were written – were “signed” – on tables of stone even “with the
finger of God”, wasn’t meant to show its indestructibility and perpetuity;
but its fragility and temporariness— so graphically illustrated by Moses with
the first set of tables. In or under the
New Covenant God’s works are said to be done and his ‘laws’ written on our
hearts and in the temple of our minds.
Not in a sanctuary made from the skins of blood-offerings, but in the
Sanctuary “made without hands” where Eternal Waters of Life spring from
the Most Holy and Throne in God’s
Have someone lost
something?
NOWHERE is it said God
makes or will make or did make, the laws of the Old Covenant ‘obsolete’, or let ‘disappear’
the sign of Covenant relationship and fidelity, or changed Covenant
partner! NOWHERE! And never shall or can it be alleged so
falsely that God made the laws of the Old Covenant ‘obsolete’, and let ‘disappear’ the sign of Covenant
relationship “particularly”,
and changed Covenant partner! God
forbid! On the contrary, never before
did God so strictly demand as in Jesus Christ that the very laws of His ONLY
COVENANT OF GRACE be fully obeyed and their disobedience be fully answered for,
and its sign so particularly be prominent and held high and honoured to witness
of faithfulness and unfaithfulness on the part of Covenanter and covenanted.
Even in Christ the
That is the Gospel Truth
about the Covenant of Grace the only and eternal Covenant of God Almighty and
Merciful.
John:
“The New Testament nowhere commands Christians to
observe the Sabbath.”
Observer:
“.... it would be quite surprising if it did, as
it was written by Jews to Jews about a Jew. They were quite aware of the
Tanach!! They memorized it!!”
GE:
No, but why should it? We are no longer serving under the age of the
Law, are we? No, “The New Testament nowhere commands Christians to
observe the Sabbath” because Christians aren’t supposed to be legalists.
They need not constantly insist, Law! Law! Grace is enough for New Testament Christians;
the Love of God, Jesus Christ, their Perfect Leader and Example. Who needs a
Law but the dissatisfied with the Leader and Example, “Author and Finisher
of the Faith”?
But frankly, this is
incorrect, that “The New
Testament nowhere commands Christians to observe the Sabbath.”
What about Hb4:8-10? “A
keeping of the Sabbath remains / remains obligatory / mandatory / valid for the
People of God” – for his New Testament People, Spiritual Israel?
What about directly
Sabbath-keeping implying texts like Colossians 2:12-19 and many others in the
Acts of the Apostles?
I regard of greatest
importance for the Church in the matter of Sabbath’s-belief and obligation the
FACT the Gospels were written later in the early Christian era, so that they
supply the picture of mature Christianity, with no shred of evidence of a
Sabbathless Christianity or of a Sunday-worshipping Christianity.
But not only the Gospels.
The WHOLE New Testament testifies to a purely and exclusively Sabbath-observing
Christian Community and Christian Communion. No single word or idea suggests
another order during the first century within the
And lastly – but which
factor should actually be considered in the first place – the Unity and
Correlation of New and Old Testaments MUST be accepted in its ‘God-given and therefore eschatologically
imperative WHOLENESS’.
(Lohmeyer) To treat the Old
Testament wholly differently as though it contradicts the New Testament is an
injustice done to both Testaments. If we
treat dutifully with the Scriptures we shall find no place or occasion for
‘Sunday’; while we inevitably will find witness to the Seventh Day Sabbath of
the LORD your God overwhelming, in both Testaments.
Much of this indication to
the Christian Seventh Day Sabbath and Lord’s Day is not at all known by most
Christians; to say the truth, most of such knowledge and insight lie buried
under the dust of two thousand years of ignorance and indoctrination.
John:
“The church is warned of many sins in the New Testament,
but breaking (or observing) the Sabbath is never mentioned.”
GE:
Ja, in fact! Is it not
noteworthy! But give credit where credit
is due, the early ‘
Then again, No! It is NOT
so that “The church is warned of many sins
in the New Testament, but breaking (or observing) the Sabbath is never
mentioned.” In the Gospels
Christ finds Himself in constant CONFLICT with religious order and society over
the Sabbath and how it ought to be observed the Christ-like way, in other
words, how to keep it and not to break it. Remember, the Gospels reflect the
time of their writing, which was the time of the ESTABLISHED Christian Church
and the society and the geography and the worldview of the ESTABLISHED
Christian Community.
A striking incident of
Sabbath-trouble IN THE CHURCH, is found in Acts 13, where the Jews chose to
boycott the Sabbath Assemblies of the Christian Church, rather than accept
Jesus Christ their New Law and Redeemer. This was a blatant instance of
transgression of the Fourth Commandment, which, as before happened in their
past while they turned their backs on his Sabbath Day, as if naturally resulted
in the Jews turning their backs on God.
Of direct breaking of the
Sabbath there in fact is NO mention being made in the New Testament; but of
‘direct’ Sabbaths’ observance, there are MANY incidences and examples.
John:
“The book of Acts mentions
the Sabbath nine times, never once as a day of worship for Christians.”
GE:
Which is not true.
Acts 2:1-4 was a Sabbath’s-case of ‘a day of worship for Christians’ and of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 13:27 was a case of “Whosoever among you
feareth God” ‘of worship for Christians’.
Acts 13:44 was a case of ‘a day of worship for Christians’, exclusively “Gentiles”, literally “on-the-to-hear-the-Word-of-God-Sabbath”—
so clearly there the Seventh Day of the week Sabbath after the Sixth Day-“in-between-sabbath”
(Tishri 10) 13:40-43.
Acts 15:21 was a case of “EVERY Sabbath day”, ‘of worship for Christians’, ‘heathen’, mainly.
Acts 16:13 was a case of ‘a day of worship for Christians’, ‘heathen’ Christians, preached to.
Acts 17:2 was a case of “THREE Sabbaths” ‘of worship for Christians’, “Jews .... and devout Greeks” preached to;
Acts 18:4 was a case of several Sabbaths – “every
Sabbath” – ‘a day of worship for Christians’ and of their persecution over being Christians— “Jews,
and Greeks”.
One instance only of Jews only, mainly foreign Jews, on Pentecost-Sabbath, ‘of worship for Christians’ in Acts.
EVERY other case in Acts ‘of worship for Christians’ on the Sabbath, was of
Jews and Greeks, but mostly, of ‘Greeks’ or ‘heathen’.
“The book of Acts mentions” at least nine cases plus an indefinite continuation
of ‘a day of worship for Christians’ (15:21 and 18:4) irrespective, in Gentile countries,
“on the Sabbath Day”.
What about the innumerable times of the usual and taken for granted Sabbaths ‘of worship for Christians’ not mentioned but implied or not mentioned but still
implied in Acts? E.g., in Acts 28:14, “We found brethren and were asked to
tarry with them (‘hehmeras hepta’) one / a seven-day” Singular or
Plural – generally for, ‘the Sabbath’.
This is how things were “in Acts”, while there is not a
single case in Acts of mention or inference to or from ‘a day of worship for Christians’ on the First Day of the week; Acts 20:7 being no
exception. In 20:7 yet another Sabbath’s
congregation of the “disciples” is implied. The “disciples” – fellow missionaries
of Paul’s – names and countries are listed in verse 4; they seem to have been
‘Gentiles’.
Most significant is that the cases of mention of Early
Christian Sabbaths’ Assemblies in Acts are without exception from the ‘era’ of
PAUL’S ministry to the ‘heathen’ Gentiles, AFTER the initial ‘Jewish-stage’ of
Peter and the other apostles ‘stationed’ in Jerusalem. Legalists, Paul, Luke,
Statistics statistics ....!
John:
“If anything, the Apostle Paul rebuked the Galatians for
attempting to add the observance of days to the sufficiency of Christ’s work
for salvation (Gal. 4:9-11).”
GE:
Exactly! “Superstitiously
observing days, months, season, years .... the no-gods first-principles you
desire to turn back to ....” pagan deities, the four mythological ‘gods’ of
time of Greek ‘wisdom’, and therefore chief of ‘days’: “lord”, as well as “queen of days”, “the lord sun’s day”, ‘Sunday’; not God’s Holy
Day the Sabbath! Note the quotation
marks. They are for real! Sunday then as
today was called and venerated “queen of days” and “the lord sun’s day”,
typical and chief of hermaphrodite Greek and other deities.
John:
“The church even changed their day of worship from
Saturday (the Jewish Sabbath) to Sunday (the Lord’s Day) (Ac. 20:7; 1 Cor.
16:2) to show that a new order had been erected with the resurrection of Christ
(Jn. 20:1, 19).”
GE:
Totally unacceptable
because totally untrue! Books compressed
into one short paragraph of ungrounded, un-Scriptural wildest speculation— to
answer will take volumes. Enough therefore to state a few facts only:
Who is the Church to think
it can “change their day of worship”? It does not have the power or the
authority.
Who is the Church that
thinks it can “change their day of worship”? It is “he (who) thinks to change
the times and Law”— antichrist.
Not “The Jewish Sabbath” or “Saturday” at any stage ever was “day of worship” of “the church”.
“The church” never “changed their day of worship”.
“Sunday” did not in Apostolic times
become “day of worship”
of “The church”.
Where do you read of “the resurrection of Christ”
in “Jn. 20:1, 19”?
John:
Jesus Christ through His redemptive work regained the Sabbath that Adam
lost.
..............
The Sabbath was a sign that pointed to something greater.
Like much of the Old Testament, the Sabbath pointed to Jesus Christ. The Old
Testament Sabbath preached the gospel when it called for faith and a cessation
of work (
GE:
Beautiful!
John:
“We dishonor our Savior when the signs still receive the
preeminence that He alone deserves.”
GE:
The Sabbath never “receive(d) the preeminence that He alone deserves.” On the contrary, the People of God has always
trampled the Sabbath underfoot ....
Instead they erected their own idol, Sunday, to bow before and “superstitiously
worship” (‘paratehreoh’). The Church
has gone so far as to change the Law and Times of God, just as it was
prophesied it would happen, in worship of Sunday— a cold as hard fact hotter
than the sun so revered.
Besides, the Sabbath never
“receive(d) the preeminence that
our Savior alone deserves” from ANYONE. What you do, is transgression of the Ninth
Commandment to accuse falsely.
The Sabbath has been
transgressed consistently either by disregard and being hated; or as tool of
self-righteousness and will-worship, which two abuses of it neither is the Sabbath
or the Sabbath-keeping of the works of God’s well-pleasing.
We dishonor our Savior when
we disregard and despise the ‘signs’
that He Himself instated to witness of Him and to serve his Lordship, his
People and the Covenant between them.
John:
“Now that Jesus is here, the signs have become obsolete
(Heb. 8:13).
GE:
You may repeat it a
thousand times, it will remain the same lying report about what the Scriptures
really declare in Hebrews chapters eight and nine, explained above.
John:
“The Apostle Paul said, "Therefore no one is to act
as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new
moon or a Sabbath day--things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but
the substance belongs to Christ" (Col. 2:16-17).”
GE:
Exactly! Now tell us what is against the Sabbath in
this; and next, What is pro-Sunday in this?
And I shall tell you that
this— “Col. 2:16-17”
and context,
is a positively
pro-Sabbaths’ Feast of Christ Scripture
in its own right and outstandingly
glorifying of the Christ
and “The Body of
Christ’s Own”—
summed up in the words of
verse 19 where
“.... holding fast to
the Head from which all the Body (the Church) by joints and bands having
nourishment ministered – and KNIT TOGETHER – INCREASETH WITH THE INCREASE OF
GOD, wherefore ye be DEAD WITH CHRIST, FROM the rudiments (false gods) of the
world.”
A:
This last phrase of verse 20a,
“wherefore ye be DEAD WITH CHRIST, FROM the rudiments (false gods) of the
world”,
B:
the phrase in verse 19, “being
knit together”, and
C:
the admonition in verse 18, “let
no man beguile you” —
go and pick them up before
the section verses 15-19,
C:
in 8 (x18), to “Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy”;
B:
in 2 and 7 (x19), “being knit
together in love unto acknowledgement of the mystery of God .... rooted and
built up in Him and stablished in the faith”; and
A:
in 12-13 (x20a), being “dead” .... “buried
with Him” —
where the ‘externals’ serve
as ‘fixation’ of what is in between, and
enclose the essence of the
‘internals’,
verses 15 to 17,
“Having spoiled
principalities and powers (of the world, evil and sin) He made a shew of
them openly, TRIUMPHING over them in it. Let no man therefore judge you in
eating or drinking, or in respect of eating and drinking of Feast, whether of
month’s or of Sabbaths’, which are but shadow of things a coming, even the Body
of Christ’s Own.”
Exegetes call it a Chiasm
(more or less) that focusses
through the indicators (‘signs’ or ‘externals’)
into the centre of the
essentials (‘internals’).
So that here in Colossians
2 is found
“The People of God”
– “The Body of Christ’s Own” – “JUDGED”:
“JUDGED with regard to
eating and drinking of Sabbaths’ Feast” ....
“JUDGED”: “WITH CHRIST” ....
“JUDGED”: “WITH CHRIST dead from the first principles
of the WORLD” ....
“JUDGED .... WITH CHRIST
.... with regard to Sabbaths’ Feast” ....
“JUDGED .... HOLDING
FAST to the Head from which all the Body by joints and bands having nourishment
ministered and KNIT TOGETHER INCREASETH WITH THE INCREASE OF GOD.”
“JUDGED”: “ALIVE to God through Christ” Ro6:11
....
18 “Let no man therefore
beguile you of your reward ....” you HAVE BEEN JUDGED! You have been weighed— “Let
no man dare judge you wanting!” “Let
no man dare judge you” ‘legalist’!
“ENJOY!” “ENJOY eating and drinking of Sabbath’s
Feast!” ENJOY of Jesus Christ! ENJOY of eating and drinking
of the Bread and the Water of Life!
Call that, ‘legalist’? Call that, ‘externals’? Then be it! It is “according
to the Scriptures”, “blameless”, “unblameable” – ‘un-judgable
/ un-condemnable’ – worship of and service to the Lord Jesus Christ. Who cares what the world judges us for?
John:
“Jesus is the new Joshua that leads God’s children to a
greater Promised Land of rest (Mt. 1:21). Jesus is the new Sabbatical Jubilee
(Lev. 25:8-10) that provides a greater cancellation of debts (Lk. 4:18-19).”
GE:
Yea! As long as you don’t
dare feast Sabbaths’ Feast .... or say a word against worshipping Sundays ....
because that’s ‘legalist’!
It is high time the
hypocrisy and legalism of the Sunday-Jesus myth is exposed. It is time the Church starts silencing by
murdering her accusers again .... That she has already started doing, having
murdered already many pure words of Holy Scriptures.
John:
“Jesus Christ has now become the Sabbath rest for
Christians under the New Covenant.”
GE:
See what I mean ....
John:
“God has completed His work of the new creation.
Christians are the first fruits of that creation (2 Cor.. 5:17; Gal. 6:15).”
GE:
In neither of these
Scriptures “are Christians the first fruits of
the new creation”. That’s our
problem; we Christians usurp the position of Christ; we have become Lucifers.
If only we can lord it over others and have our own ‘Word’ for final.
John:
“Our rest, as it was enjoyed by Adam everyday, has again
been restored.”
GE:
“Man being in honour
abideth not.” Ps49:12. Adam “lodged not for a night”. “His teeth
watered at the apple, and ever since it has made our eyes water. .... See the
wonderful goodness of God, who was pleased when man had forfeited the first
covenant, to enter into a new covenant with him. Well may it be called faedus
gratiae, a covenant of grace; for it is bespangled with promises as the heaven
with stars.” Thomas Watson, ‘A Body of Divinity’ 3/1. God entered into NEW
Covenant – the Covenant of GRACE – “In the cool of the day / evening” already
in Genisis 3:8 in and through Jesus Christ (with man), after the Sixth Day and Adam’s
first and only in paradise.
‘Christ restored the Rest of God’
spurned by Adam at his fall. For Christ “entered into his own rest as God
....” “the Seventh Day” “.... wherefore remains a keeping of the
Sabbath Day for the People of God”, Hb4:10,4,9.
John:
“During this life we still deal with some remnants of
the curse, but we recognize our rest in Christ (from meritorious works) through
faith and daily worship (Col. 3:17).”
GE:
“Col. 3:17” .... This Scripture does NOT
imply “daily worship”.
It does not generalise or speak of “daily worship” or ‘worship’ of every day of everyone by himself.
“Let the peace of God
rule in your hearts, to which also, ye are CALLED IN ONE BODY; and be ye
thankful. Let the Word of God dwell IN
YOU (in your assemblies in One Body) richly in all wisdom; teaching and
admonishing ONE ANOTHER in Psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing
(when IN ONE BODY assembled) with grace in your hearts to the Lord (in
Sabbaths’ worship congregated).”
Paul addresses the
Believers of “The Body of Christ’s Own” AS WHEN ASSEMBLED in worship for
worship, they worshipped; in the first place.
Paul of course also, speaks to the believers as individuals, but to them
primarily and essentially as the Church of the “CALLED” WHEN come
together “in one Body”.
“Worship” in Colossians as a whole, by
definition narrows down to Congregational
Worship .... to the Church in the world of unbelief in which it finds itself. Colossians focussus on Believers-Come-Together-for-to-worship in 3:9 to 17 — including “Col. 3:17” — as it focussus on Believers-Come-Together-for-to-worship in 2:12-20a, “SABBATHS”, in the face of a hostile and condemning world!
The Church congregating “of Sabbaths’ Feast”, the only day the
WHOLE New Testament knows, or ever mentions, or suggests or implies with regard
to Corporate Worship. (Not individual “daily worship”.)
To deny its “Sabbaths’
Feast-worship” is to deny the Congregational worship of the
John:
“Due to His redemptive work, He has become our Sabbath
rest.”
GE:
No; due to His redemptive
work, Christ has become our rest; and ‘our rest’ is He Who is GOD’S Rest which
God has “entered into” and has given us, as the free gift of his Grace
to also share in: to us to also share in THROUGH and IN Jesus Christ— to us to
also share in NOT in ourselves or in ANY of our own doing or work or – for that
matter – own ‘rest’.
Hebrews uses DIFFERENT
WORDS ALTOGETHER to describe God’s Rest in and through Jesus Christ, and “a
keeping” literally “of the Sabbath Day: for the People of God”, the
words ‘katapausis’ for “rest”; and ‘sabbatismos’ for “a keeping of
the Sabbath Day”.
It is sheer dishonesty to
keep these things quiet; they are kept quiet in the vain hope to get away with
the lie of Sunday-worship.
God’s Rest is not the
consequence of his Sabbath Rest; his Sabbath Rest is the consequence of God’s
Rest.
John:
“Jesus said, "Come to Me, all who are weary and
heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me,
for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For
My yoke is easy and My burden is light" (Mt. 11:28-30; c.f. Heb. 4:1-11).”
GE:
“Therefore if Today you
hear His Voice, do not harden your heart!”
“My burden is light”
and “My Sabbaths”— “My holy day .... a delight”. “The Holy of the LORD, and honourable.
.... THEN (on it) shalt thou (capital letter: “shalt Thou” for
Christ) DELIGHT Thyself in the LORD.” Is58:13.
John:
“The Christian’s ultimate Sabbath rest will be enjoyed
in heaven (Rev. 14:13; c.f. 14:11).”
GE:
Rev. 14:13; c.f. 14:11 are irrelevant Scriptures. Your comment makes nonsense. It’s artificial
Sunday-rhetoric.
John:
“Though we currently rest in Jesus Christ under the New
Covenant, our supreme Sabbatical rest will be realized in heaven where we will
enjoy the ultimate rest in the culmination of God’s new creation (Rev. 21:4;
22:1-2) away from the curse in the direct presence of the Lamb (Rev. 22:3).”
GE:
“Realized in heaven”? what reality is “in heaven” of “the Seventh Day Sabbath
of the LORD your God” on earth? It’s
a hoax; the Sunday propaganda hoax of antichrist, this “sabbatical rest realized in heaven”
myth.
“The ultimate rest in the culmination of God’s new
creation” IS, Jesus Christ; IS occurred, IN the resurrection of
Jesus Christ from the dead. “That is
why a keeping of the Sabbath by the People of God exists”, exists ever so mandatory
and down to earth and literally and ‘legally’ and ‘ceremoniously’. Whether so, or, ‘spiritually’—
“a keeping of the Sabbath by the People of God” is nothing if not “the
Seventh Day GOD, thus concerning, did SPEAK, and God the SEVENTH Day (of his
works of creation and redemption) from all his WORKS, rested.”
That, ultimately, is “the Sabbath DAY” of
which “the Son of MAN, is Lord”.
That ultimately
earthly “Seventh Day” of this creation ‘in the culmination of God’s new creation’, is “BECOME / MADE the
Sabbath”, “by the POWER of His
– Christ’s – resurrection” Phil3:10 and “by the GLORY of the Father”
Ro6:4 by which He “raised Christ from the dead and exalted Him at the right
hand of the throne of God in heavenly exaltation” Eph1:19-20.
‘In the culmination of God’s new creation’ “the Seventh Day .... was made .... the
Sabbath Day”, in its ‘ultimate’
realisation’ in Christ, through Christ, in and through resurrection from the
dead, “Sabbath’s” Mt28:1.
John:
“The rest we have in Christ is our sabbath rest. We are
in Christ and "He" is our rest, forever, in Christ!”
GE:
No, the Sabbath is not “our sabbath” or “our sabbath rest”. The Sabbath belongs to God nevertheless is neither God’s, or Christ’s, or “our rest”.
“God the Seventh Day rested from all his works”, yes, but God’s WORK of to rest, was God’s rest; not the day upon which He rested, the Seventh Day.
The Sabbath is the Seventh Day from God’s original creation of the world, yes, but it “was made” ‘ultimately’, ‘In the culmination of God’s new creation’ through Christ.
The Sabbath is the Biblical, ‘human day’ of God’s “making” through the “Son of Man” “for man”, on earth.
The Sabbath is meant “for man”, but only because firstly “the Sabbath was made for ....” THIS “Man”, Jesus Christ.
The Sabbath then is also meant “for man”, but only because “a keeping of the Sabbath Day remains valid for the People of God” in the first place. “For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God .... Because the creature itself shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.” Ro8:19,21.
“For thus God concerning the Seventh Day spake: And God the Seventh Day rested from all his works.” The Sabbath makes no sense but by Jesus Christ and for Him. The Sabbath also makes no sense if not as this earthly, human, ‘observed’, “Seventh Day” of the week of God’s observance in his works of rest and rest of works through Jesus Christ in resurrection from the dead.
It is typical of Sunday-worship rhetoric to wantonly adorn the Sabbath with the dross of golden mouth-service at the cost of its God-given sanctity and blessedness to serve “for the People of God” as “Body of Christ’s Own”.
What makes the Sabbath Day what it to the Commandment of God is, is that it is elect “Lord’s Day” and “Sabbath of the LORD your God” “in” which God through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead “rested from all His works”.
10 November 2009
Initial statement by
John:
Below is some information that I hope will increase your understanding of
the Sabbath rest.
The Sabbath was a command given specifically to
The Sabbath was part of God’s ceremonial law and not grounded in His unchanging
character. The Sabbath was a ceremonial
law given specifically to
The Sabbath was the sign of the Old Covenant
(Ex. 31:16-17; Neh. 9:14; Eze. 20:12). Because we are now under the New
Covenant we are no longer under obligation to keep the Old Covenant,
particularly the sign of the Old Covenant. The writer to the Hebrews remarked,
"When He said, ‘A new covenant,’ He has made the first obsolete. But
whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear" (Heb.
8:13).
The New Testament nowhere commands Christians to observe the Sabbath. The church is warned of many sins in the New
Testament, but breaking (or observing) the Sabbath is never mentioned. The book
of Acts mentions the Sabbath nine times, never once as a day of worship for
Christians. If anything, the Apostle Paul rebuked the Galatians for attempting
to add the observance of days to the sufficiency of Christ’s work for salvation
(Gal. 4:9-11). The church even changed their day of worship from Saturday (the
Jewish Sabbath) to Sunday (the Lord’s Day) (Ac. 20:7; 1 Cor. 16:2) to show that
a new order had been erected with the resurrection of Christ (Jn. 20:1, 19).
Jesus Christ through His redemptive work regained the Sabbath that Adam lost. Jesus Christ came to complete a redemptive
work (Jn. 4:34; 5:36) by restoring the rest that was forfeited in the Garden.
In following the same pattern for the first creation, Jesus Christ began the
work spoken of in Genesis 3:15 (c.f. Gen. 1:3). He completed the work on the
cross (Jn. 17:4; 19:30; c.f. Gen. 1:5). The work was met with God’s satisfaction
by the resurrection and ascension of Christ (
The Sabbath was a sign that pointed to something greater. Like much of the Old Testament, the Sabbath
pointed to Jesus Christ. The Old Testament Sabbath preached the gospel when it
called for faith and a cessation of work (
Jesus Christ has now become the Sabbath rest for Christians under the New
Covenant. God has completed His work of
the new creation. Christians are the first fruits of that creation (2 Cor..
5:17; Gal. 6:15). Our rest, as it was enjoyed by Adam everyday, has again been
restored. During this life we still deal with some remnants of the curse, but
we recognize our rest in Christ (from meritorious works) through faith and
daily worship (Col. 3:17). Due to His redemptive work, He has become our
Sabbath rest. Jesus said, "Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden,
and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am
gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke
is easy and My burden is light" (Mt. 11:28-30; c.f. Heb. 4:1-11).
The Christian’s ultimate Sabbath rest will be enjoyed in heaven (Rev. 14:13;
c.f. 14:11). Though we currently rest in Jesus Christ under the New Covenant,
our supreme Sabbatical rest will be realized in heaven where we will enjoy the
ultimate rest in the culmination of God’s new creation (Rev. 21:4; 22:1-2) away
from the curse in the direct presence of the Lamb (Rev. 22:3).
.....
I hope this will help you with your understanding of the rest we have in
Christ, who is our sabbath rest. We are in Christ and "He" is our
rest, forever, in Christ!
John
StJohn’s closing statement:
I've
noticed that your website is all about the Sabbath too. You are very obsessive.
:-(
Your email address has been added to my blocked senders list (blacklisted), you
can send all you want too, but after this one, I will never see them and never
know you have sent them. They will be immediately deleted, so please, send all
you want. I'd be very happy to know you're wasting all your time on me and not
bothering anyone else.
The Lockman foundation is aware of your stalking. Be assured my obsessive
friend that it will be dealt with. SBF is a Bible study, it is not a place to
push dogmatic doctrinal heterodoxy. :-(
Goodbye
Gerhard Ebersöhn
Private Bag X43
Sunninghill 2157
http://www.biblestudents.co.za